Post #2348277

2026-05-06 16:18 UTC

@KatyElphinstone@mas.to This is one of the most fascinating aspects of autism to me. I'd love to understand the neurology and socialization behind that need for justice and fairness. Maybe that's just the reasonable way to see things, but NTs are so obsessed with social status that they feel justice is secondary to getting along with people who can affect your social standing. I always think of that psych study that said autistic people were deficient because we were TOO ethical, because we wouldn't cheat even if it would benefit us and we knew we would get away with it. They said that means we aren't capable of acting immorally to benefit ourselves, and because that's not how NTs act it's an impairment, like that's an actual problem you should fix. One thing it took me getting used to about the autistic community was how commonly folks think that NT society is fundamentally dishonest and everyone is lying all the time, mostly for the sake of their social status, but also because it's assumed everyone else is lying about everything too. From job interviews where everyone is expected to lie so everything you say is assumed to be a lie, to empty "let's grab coffee soon" promises that never materialize, NT society is all about pretense and faking it until making it. Everything is about keeping up appearances, and that's not compatible with justice or even fairness.

Replies (5)

@coolcalmcollected@mastodon.social 2026-05-06 16:53

@joshsusser@autistics.life @KatyElphinstone@mas.to this is the crux of the "communication mismatch" between ND and NT. we're saying exactly what we mean and NT's lie so habitually they don't understand what words are anymore. they think everything is subtext and are "reading between the lines" to fit whatever they read or hear to what they want to read or hear. this is also why ND's job security is precarious everywhere. their coworkers are, at best, perpetually not listening and at worst maliciously not listening.

Open ##2348278
@KatyElphinstone@mas.to 2026-05-06 19:50

@joshsusser@autistics.life Yes, so bizarre that being too ethical can be presented as a deficit 🤷‍♀️

Open ##2348279
@d1@autistics.life 2026-05-06 19:59

@joshsusser@autistics.life @KatyElphinstone@mas.to There might be a cultural aspect as well, as to how much exaggeration - shades of lying - is normal and generally tolerated. Some cultures have a stronger expectation that "one's word is one's bond". IMHO, it's typically the older-world, medieval, clan-style, "tight" cultures, where reputation matters a lot more. There's no rule of law to save one, only one's posse who's going to watch one's back. So one's "word" (and neighbourhood reputation) takes on more gravity. "Rule-of-law" cultures might allow increasingly more shades of lying. After all, it will shake out in the courtroom, who's embellished version of the truth is "officially" true, should it ever come to that. Under these conditions, it may allow people to go on ahead and bullshit as much as they like, knowing where the dotted line is, so to speak, at least keeping out of the courtroom.

Open ##2348283
@NicelyManifest@mastodon.social 2026-05-06 20:02

@joshsusser@autistics.life @KatyElphinstone@mas.to As an AuDHD, I feel that the greater sensory data received - life is amplified - often makes us seek calm and order. And injustice therefore stands out like a thorn - things should be lined up, correct, ordered - to minimise overwhelm. And injustice feels greater for AuDHD because it too is amplified. My view.

Open ##2348284
@saramg@fosstodon.org 2026-05-06 20:14

@joshsusser@autistics.life @KatyElphinstone@mas.to I won't pretend to have the answers, but... IME, for the Autism side at least (and apologies for the oversimplifying), it stems from a couple areas: 1/ Rigid thinking. X is right, ergo Not-X is wrong. 2/ Not "getting" the social rules intrinsically, and having to build a consistent set from observations. When a rule is only a rule sometimes, then it's not a rule, but I can still be punished for breaking it? Rude. As for ADHD, lots are secretly AuDHD. :p

Open ##2348286