DudleyMason

Nothing that was already good has ever been improved by mayonnaise. Mayo is a topping people put on mediocre and boring foods to make them edible.

Nobody needs to infiltrate the left to get them not to vote for the center-right Democratic Party. The elected Democrats do that quite well with no help whatsoever.

All I'm getting here is that you don't understand the actual meaning of a lot of the words you're using, and that you uncritically accept Imperialist framing of everything. China isn't practicing "unfettered capitalism", because their economy is under the control of the people through the Communist Party. What they are practicing is a form of socialism, the middle state between capitalism and communism which includes parts of both. China did produce more billionaires than the US last year. Developing economies tend to do that faster and more often than stale ones. China also sentenced more billionaires to death for exploitation last year than the US has ever, but that little data point doesn't fit with your CIA approved narrative. "Supplying arms to war torn countries" is that Fedspeak for "giving oppressed nations and resistance groups the ability to fight back against Imperialism"? China is not an "authoritarian Oligarchy", you're thinking of the United States. The U.S. is an Oligarchy? The Research, Explained | RepresentUs https://share.google/JIlxY85GIDUfoKG6o China is a robust democracy where people have direct control, so parties in the Western sense are unnecessary and undesirable. Studies show strong public support for China’s political system https://share.google/T9Bm5GvSUW0Xt0hdz

Mayonnaise on grilled cheese is an abomination. For the absolute best grilled cheese ever just put sliced cheese between two slices of bread, drop 2 tbsp (28.5g for those of you not using freedom units) of butter in a pan just hot enough to make it sizzle, put your sandwich in the melted butter and flip after 3 minutes.

>authoritarian apologists. Authoritarianism is a useless term created by Liberals to obfuscate the differences between Socialism and Fascism. Russia is a vaguely protofascist Oligarchy, that's kind of true. They only deserve support in so far as their actions weaken imperial hegemony. China is not at all fascist and it's laughable that you suggest it is. Unless your definition of Fascism is "when the government says there are things I'm not allowed to do"...

It damn sure doesn't change by legitimizing it with your vote every couple of years.

Looks like we have a genocide stanning, Blue MAGA party loyalist, just in time for the next election, what a strange coincidence.

Good news, we've had that for almost 100 years: Read Soviet Democracy(Pat Sloan, 1937) on ProleWiki https://share.google/A2wORPR6VfQAi4E5B

Because that's the only reasonable explanation for their actions. They can't possibly be as incompetent as they're pretending. "They're not trying to win, they're trying to ensure you keep enough faith in the system to prevent you from revolting" is the Occams Razor explanation.

Yep sure is

We have a lot of center right politicians, most of the Democratic Party fits that description. They’re only “left” of the Republican party. They are not objectively on the left. The furthest left flank of the party (like Pramila Jayapal or Adelita Grijalva) could maybe be seen as center left, but the majority of the party is firmly right of center.

So my question stands. I knew what you meant, now explain why sex is a special sphere of human activity that is materially different from any other human interaction without resorting to magical thinking.

>If two parties agreed to it under no sense of duress As long as monogamy is considered the default and something most people wouldn't ever consider getting away from, it's impossible to enter a monogamous relationship absent coercion, because the coercion is societal. Just like there's no such thing as voluntary employment under a capitalist system, there's no such thing as voluntary monogamy in a world dominated by Western, Bronze-age sexual politics.

>only if you essentially do not view sex as any more sacred, or complex and meaningful, than food... Why on Earth would anyone who isn't indoctrinated into a religion ever think that sex is more sacred than any other form of human interaction?

Clearly you don’t love having the giant Bronze-age patriarchal bullshit sized holes in your reasoning pointed out. Go on pretending anyone who isn’t exactly the same kind of ascetic you are is just a “Treatlerite”. It definitely doesn’t make you look ridiculous to leftists and liberals alike.

I think people should have sex with who they want. Not who they are forced to because of poverty. Fine. Me too. But I also think people should speak to and do nice things for who they want, not who they’re forced to because of poverty. But you put sex work in a different category from customer service or the service industry in general. The only way that works is if you think sex is magical and different from conversation or service. And the only way that makes sense is if you’ve swallowed the bronze age bullshit sexual mores that dominate most of the world today. And you’re still absolutely refusing to engage with the actual point, so I have to just assume you’re being disingenuous at this point.

Why are there so many Nazi soldiers on that list?

Ok, I get it, you believe very passionately in bronze age sexual mores. You don’t have a persuasive case to make that the things you’ve listed here are unique to sex work, nor have you addressed my point about other forms of exploitive labor and marginalized people. I suspect that’s because deep down you know there is no case to make there, unless you start from the position that sex is special and magical, and you’re simply not used to arguing against someone who explicitly rejects that presupposition. Also. My previous Links were from university websites. Research articles about published peer reviewed articles and Wikipedia articles to define definitions. Literally everyone can just scroll up a few replies to see that it’s exactly what I said: two Wikipedia articles, one opinion piece by an anti sex work crusader org with literal cops and Neoliberal politicians on its board, and a study that doesn’t control for any confounding factors (most such studies are funded by the LDS or Catholic Church, so they don’t control for those factors bcs they know they won’t get the results they’re being paid for if they do. Didn’t read far enough to know of your study is one of those, but statistically speaking the odds are good). Have you ever considered which systematic aspects of our society fuel the patriarchy and inequality or do you think it just appeared one day and stays around for no reason? I’ve read extensively on the subject and I will say again what I’ve said several times in this thread: 100% of patriarchy comes from the belief that sex is special and magical and from that the ideas of virginity and purity come to guarantee paternity and maximize the selling price of daughters, from there comes almost all of the forms of patriarchy. Now if you can explain without any magical thinking or putting sex into a special category just why you think that sex workers arearginallzed and exploited in a way that is materially different from undocumented farm workers, please do so. If not, please shut the hell up, because it’s now painfully obvious to everyone that your magical thinking doesn’t hold up to any scrutiny.

Sex is categorically not “uniquely intimate”. A stimulating conversation about a subject you’re both passionate about is a far more intimate thing that a drunken bar bathroom hookup. That kind of magical thinking is the problem. It’s an incredibly slippery and not very long slope from “sex is a magical and unique form of human interaction” to “daughters are property of their fathers until they are sold and become property of their husbands”.

leaves you with less options in your social life, pays barely enough to get by, and is way way more intrusive to the laborer. it’s clearly not like other work.

Yeah, I forgot about all the incredibly fulfilling fast food and coffee jobs that pay a living wage and are easy to get by on.

It clearly is like any other service work, unless you believe sex is a magical, special sphere of human activity. And if you do, then you’re thinking magically and not materialistically.

I literally gave multiple resources links in my original comment. Wikipedia articles and opinion pieces by political advocacy groups run by Neoliberal politicians and literal cops aren’t very strong evidence of anything. The one actual study you linked, like most others in its (usually church funded) genre, just proves something anyone could have told you: marginalizing a group of workers makes them more vulnerable to exploitation and less able to seek legal help when it happens. Any undocumented farm worker could tell you the same thing.

I mean, I didn’t decide that, that’s just kind of how it works.

Magical thinking bullshit. Sex is exactly as sacred as a one on one game of basketball, and almost every bit of the Patriarchy tests on the foundation of denying that basic truth.

Nah, they’re right about this one and you’re wrong. the oppression required to maintain their treatlerite life. If you don’t feel the same way about fast food workers, convenience store clerks, and baristas, your problem isn’t with the exploitation, it’s with the sex.

Because thinking about it magically leads you to idiotic conclusions like “maybe the bronze age goat fuckers really did discover the ultimate truth of sexual morality, and it’s just coincidence that it just so happened to lay the foundation for millennia of Patriarchal bullshit”.

perpetuates the very systems that harm us under the guise of “sexual empowerment”. No matter how you spin it as “empowerment” or anything else. When you’re using the same “arguments” as an evangelical televangelist to rebut an argument no one is making, I suspect you’re probably not arguing in good faith.

You keep making claims, but you don’t bring any evidence. I suspect that’s because you know how utterly unscientific most of the “studies” that support your position are and how the only thing they really prove is that exploitation of labor is bad regardless of the kind of labor. But since you’re really dedicated to the “sex is special and magical” kind of bullshit magical thinking, I’m sure they seem very persuasive to you.

People who think metaphysically about sex are not ever going to see the logical inconsistencies in their world view. To them that actually is different, because to them sex is magic and not biochemistry.

>Because I have dignity and self-respect. Not of you're publicly announcing that you're so backwards-minded that you look down on sex workers, you don't. Imagine being that gross of a person and proud of it.

How so? What’s the difference between Halle Berry getting an extra million to take her top off in Swordfish and an Onlyfans girl, aside from the number of zeroes on the check?

It’s something young women/men should be aware of that they automatically exclude themselves from a huge part of the dating pool when they make a decision like that. And nothing of value is lost. Who wants to date someone with weird moralistic hangups about sex, unless they share those hangups?

Please explain what those differences are without using any magical thinking that places sex into a sacred sphere of human activity that is holy and sacrosanct? Or don’t. My point is you can tell how serious a person is when they start talking about the morality of sex by replacing every mention of sex in their point with “boxing”. It’s still a highly physical one-on-one activity that’s a crime of both participants haven’t consented, so if the exact same argument doesn’t make sense when made about boxing then they are thinking magically about sex and not materialistically.

Okay so you don’t actually know anyone who has aged out of sex work . And obviously neither do you. But I do know men women and enbys still doing and enjoying sex work at the age you specifically picked as the age where they “can’t” do it anymore and their life will be over for having done sex work. Which was my point, and one you’ve utterly failed to engage with since you now know you were very wrong. My “puritanical views”. Is this a joke? No, it’s a quote, and I apparently misremembered it, since the original word was “moralistic” not “puritanical”. To be clear: sex work is as bad as any other form of labor coerced by capitalism, it just isn’t worse than any other form of labor coerced by capitalism. Only the kind of magical thinking that says sex is some special sphere of human activity that should be considered sacred would ever tell you otherwise. And the pimps, Epsteins, and human traffickers of the world benefit directly from moralistic views of sex. If we treated sex exactly the same as any other full contact sport, there would be far less danger for sex workers who report bad behavior from clients or employers, and there would be far less demand from creeps who want to buy children, because there is a definite correlation (even if no proven causal link) between heavily moralistic views of sex and CSA. This is why religious leaders so often wind up being child rapists. Finally if you think there’s anything strawman or whataboutism in comparing sex work to any other form of work under capitalism, then you do not understand the point I’m making at all, which is that there is no moral difference between the sex worker and the coal miner in a capitalist society. In a socialist society there’s a discussion to be had about whether sex work is socially necessary labor, but there is no question it is labor.

Because most cultures have been heavily influenced by cultures descended from the bronze age sheep fuckers who came up with the idea of virginity as a way of ensuring paternity and maximizing the price they could charge for selling their preteen daughters to old men.

think you are really downplaying the risks here. I have friends who have done sex work. As do I. Friends and family both. And I have never heard a sex worker say any of the things you ascribe to them. Do sex work in your 20s instead of developing a career. Then when you are too old and 40 with no job prospects and no skills, and no one wants you. What then ? I’m wondering if you actually know that many people in the industry. Bcs I’m middle aged, everyone I know who does SW is close to my age, so they’re all 35+, mostly over 40, and doing fine. But if that weren’t the case, the same question can be asked of anyone doing manual labor, once your body breaks down (which happens a lot earlier for manual laborers), what do you do? To borrow an old quote: If you think that the prostitute sells her body and the coal miner does not, your view of labor is clouded by your puritanical view of sex.

I'm for it. Any form of advertising aside from maybe a press release to announce a new product/service, and also any form of commissioned sales.

So that's a solid "no" on having any argument at all besides "nuh uh!" And "I don't like the way the things you're saying makes me feel so ill dismiss them without actually addressing them"?

Your stance would be believable of you'd just ignored what I said. You felt the need to respond, but don't have the capacity to respond to the substance. So you pick a line of hyperbole and argue passionately against that. It'd be funny if there weren't 300 million people just like you helping destroy the world so they can go watch the game in peace.

>And regardless the implication you're making is that everyone not exactly aligned with you doesn't care about the future and spends all their time doing frivolous shit. Not everyone, just the ones who attend "protests" on weekends that have police permits and march with people carrying signs that say "If Kamala has won we'd be at brunch". Because we know that. You don't understand what the problem is, so you let the people profiting from the problem convince you that the real problem is that the "good guys" lost the election rather than the fact that there are no good guys and the people selling the narrative steal a little more from you every administration regardless of which team of Wall St Fellating shitbags won the big game. Elections in the US are just more bread and circuses, the Epstein class owns both parties tip to tail.

Ways that you disagree with. Fine. Until those ways are supporting genocide and the enslavement of 99.9% of the planets population to the insatiable greed of the tiny fraction of the world the status quo was created to work for. Then we have a real problem, and I’m not gonna “agree to disagree” with anyone taking that stance.

I love how you only ever respond to the vibe of something and not what was actually said, it's so totally Schumerist.

If it's got you out of your brunch spot and in the streets protesting US imperialism then it's already done more than four years of Kopmala would have.

Must be, since you couldn't address any of the actual substance of what I said and had to nit pick a bit of hyperbole.

The system is not broken. It's functioning exactly as intended.

>who could've easily been denied power if people's brains were operating at even 15% capacity. No, who could've continued operating in the back rooms while their more polite servants get on TV and whinge about how there's nothing they can do to improve things even with majorities in both houses and the Presidency. But at least they'd have the decency to keep the slurs in those back rooms and only murder brown kids so you could go back to brunch in peace.

We'll stop that as soon as you purge all the traitors from your party who care more about fellating Wall St than starving kids, and care more about Israeli settlers apartheid health care than their own constituents dying in the streets. When both sides aren't basically the same except for the ten or so designated culture war issues we'll stop saying both sides are the same.

Pretty sure nobody who objected to Kopmala's enthusiastic genocide support voted for Trump Redirect some of that anger your boss and landlord told you to point left at the party who couldn't come up with a candidate that could beat Trump, twice. Then save a little for all the happy, complacent Liberals who think that a quadrennial choice between "the untenable status quo" and "make everything worse" is a functional democracy worth saving or mourning.

Let’s TACO bout it.

Thanks for proving you're as illiterate about history as you are about politics. Now there's almost no chance any serious adults accidentally think you have anything intelligent to say.

Everywhere, the post is being removed - with the same generic reason: “No politics.” People who make and enforce “no politics” rules are the people who need to hear it the most, so I think you’ve been posting in the right places, keep it up!