Post #1460839

2025-12-24 19:29 UTC

@deliverator In my engineering degree plan, an engineering ethics course was mandatory. We discussed some high-profile failures like Bhopal and Chornobyl, as well as some lesser-known ones like the Hyatt Regency walkway collapse, the THERAC-25, and the Gimli Glider incident. We also spent significant time on how IBM and other big companies built machines which powered Hitler’s extermination camps. The programming and IT degrees available at the time didn’t include any ethics courses, which is part of why I’ve never felt people doing either should be called engineers.

Replies (3)

@deliverator@infosec.exchange 2025-12-24 20:20

@bob_zim yup, definitely part of the whole thing. Canada (or is it just Ontario?) has rules about having "engineer" in a job title. Some people complain about artificial gatekeeping, but words are supposed to have meaning. I don't think we've actually figured out what "software engineering" means, let alone have a means of doing it and validating it.

Open ##1460840
@LovesTha@floss.social 2025-12-25 05:52

@bob_zim @deliverator my electronic engineering degree barely touched ethics, just as one topic in the "Engineering Management" subject that was a real cakewalk. Computer science didn't mention it. We also had room for zero things outside of science, which I wish was different. It would have been nice to do some subjects on other topics.

Open ##1460841
@cwg1231@defcon.social 2025-12-26 20:46

@bob_zim @deliverator Further, I would say that unless you’re building your software to reliability standards (not goals, standards that you test) then you’re a programmer, not an engineer.

Open ##1460842